Best choice...

[Texfly]

Thanks All for the great info!

The builder in the Beaufort area have no email or ph#, I tried to reach out to one via Linkedin with no luck. I really would like to see one (possibly with the AeroVee). I might need to drive closer to one of you...

Do you guys use mostly AeroVee or other engines? Also (I might be mistaking...) I read somewhere that the AeroVees last 1000 hours. Do they mean before overhaul?

Just a heads up...I might have more questions! ;-)

[rizzz]

Hello Everyone,

I'm new in the Forum and the Sonex world. I'm a Sports Pilot student and I fell in love with the Sonex while searching which aircraft would suit my mission.

However (...darn Internet...) I found this link that worried me: http://www.zenith.aero/profiles/blogs/z ... comparison

Can you experts/pilots give me your opinion? Some of the main concerns are:

- Engine power
- Cross country
- Cabin size
- Built vs kit

Also, how do I see/test one? I live in Beaufort SC and the Marketing office answered only to my first email (no answer to my other two..). I have been able to pull most of the cost information from this forum...I will put a spreadsheet together and share.

All feedback/help is appreciated!
Tex

In my opinion they are totally different airplanes for with a different purpose. Choosing between a Sonex, Zenith or RV12 should be done with a purpose in mind. What do you want to get out of the airplane mostly? Ask yourself that question and the choice will be obvious.

Because of this lack of "purpose" in that comparison flyer from Sonex, I've always found it to be a little unfair, plus it does not list the aspects that Sonex doesn't score as good on compared to the other 2, mainly cabin space.

That said, the response letter posted on the Zenith site is even less objective and almost deceiving. Some examples:
- Sonex does (now) offer accurate lazer cut parts and matched hole technology in their kits and even before they did, compare the average Sonex build time on some of the builders logs with that of the Zenith aircraft... The aircraft is such a simple design, even scratch builders complete the aircraft with no special skills in well under 1500 hours.
- The airframe was not built for the AeroVee engine, the Sonex existed before the AeroVee and the first flew with the J2200.
- There are tens of cross country flying reports to be found on the Sonex website, many including very nice videos (if not hundreds when looking on other websites as well), just go on there and have a look. Maybe the other 2 are "better" cross country planes, people are doing massive cross country trips with their Sonex all the time.

Anyway, I guess the point I'm trying to make is that all of these commercial things like the comparisons, response letters letters, etc. from the manufacturers have to be taken with a pinch of salt. Especially when they are talking about a competitor's product.

I think everybody would agree they are all great aircraft and they all have their strong and weak points. Ask yourself what you want to be getting out of the aircraft mostly, what are absolute musts, what are things you're willing to compromise on, (importantly) what your budget is, and the choice will become obvious.
(go to Jeff Shultz's website, http://www.sonex604.com/, and click on "Why a Sonex?" You'll see Jeff did exactly that before making his choice, you'll see what and how he compromised and what he really wanted)

It might be that you want everything and are not willing to save up on anything in which case the answer is, don't build now, save up for a few years so you can buy a much more expensive aircraft that has it all.

[fastj22]

Thanks All for the great info!

The builder in the Beaufort area have no email or ph#, I tried to reach out to one via Linkedin with no luck. I really would like to see one (possibly with the AeroVee). I might need to drive closer to one of you...

Do you guys use mostly AeroVee or other engines? Also (I might be mistaking...) I read somewhere that the AeroVees last 1000 hours. Do they mean before overhaul?

Just a heads up...I might have more questions! ;-)

In my neck of the woods (6900ft MSL), we need the Jabiru 3300 (or Corvair) (or TurboVee!). There are a few Aerovee Sonex up here but they really are single place when it warms up. Lower altitude based flyers seem to gravitate towards the Aerovee, obviously due to the cost of the Jab.
As for TBO on the engines? I haven't heard of an Aerovee going 1000 hours. Seems most have some type of overhaul around 200-300 hours. Haven't heard of a Jabiru going that long either. And realistically, you are lucky to put 50 hours a year on your plane if you don't do a lot of cross countries.
If you got 500 hours out of the engine, that's 10 years.

[fastj22]

From the Zenith "response letter"...

"but no Sonex owners I’ve met take their planes anywhere - these planes don’t seem to be used for cross-country at all (because of the engine and cabin size?)"

Credibility level reduction feature fully engaged.

LOLOLOLOL... :lol:

Kip, quit rubbing it in that your Waiex has landed in 48 states. I'm trying to catch up! Got 5 down. Will add 2 more going to OSH.

[N111YX]

Not rubbing it in, just re-buffing the statement;) Here's a list of airports that I've visited in the YX. If it were a "real" X/C machine, I suppose I'd have a few more notched. See you at OSH...:)

1 Monroe, GA
2 Winder, GA
3 Athens, GA
4 Jackson Co., GA
5 Washington-Wilkes Co. GA
6 Covington, GA
7 Gainesville, GA
8 Greensboro, GA
9 Elberton, GA
10 Dahlonega, GA (Wimpys)
11 Lawrenceville, GA
12 Franklin, Co. GA
13 Milledgeville, GA
14 Clemson, SC
15 Peach State Airport, GA
16 Thomaston, GA
17 Atlanta PDK
18 Peachtree City, GA
19 Paulding Co. Airport, GA
20 Cedartown, GA
21 Rome, GA
22 Lawrenceburg, TN
23 Kennett, MO
24 Mt. Vernon, MO
25 Springfield, MO
26 Monett, MO
27 Lawrence, KS
28 Olathe, KS, Johnson Co. Industrial
29 Topeka, KS, Billard
30 Monticello, IA
31 Oshkosh, WI
32 West Bend, WI
33 Eagle Creek, Indianapolis
34 Louisville, Bowman Field, KY
35 Fort Payne AL
36 Decatur, AL
37 Marietta, GA (Cobb Co.)
38 Winchester, TN
39 Shelbyville, TN
40 Huntsville, AL, Moontown
41 Wrens, GA
42 Thompson, GA
43 Crossville, TN
44 Madison, GA
45 Augusta, GA, Daniel
46 Toccoa, GA
47 Waycross, GA
48 Dunellon, FL
49 Lake City, FL
50 Cornelia, GA
51 Macon, GA (Smart Field)
52 Dublin, GA
53 Eastman, GA
54 Anderson, SC
55 Newnan, GA
56 La Grange, GA
57 Columbus, GA
58 Zephyrhills, FL
59 Lakeland, FL
60 Plant City, FL
61 Laurens Co., SC
62 Louisburg, NC
63 Suffolk, VA
64 Kitty Hawk, NC
65 Manteo, NC
66 Erwin Co., NC
67 Tupelo, MS
68 Hot Springs, AR
69 McAlester, OK
70 Norman, OK
71 Amarillo (International), TX
72 Tucumcari, NM
73 Albuquerque (Double Eagle), NM
74 Winslow, AZ
75 Flagstaff, AZ
76 Henderson, NV
77 Redlands, CA
78 Catalina Island, CA
79 Thermal, CA
80 Buckeye, AZ
81 Phoenix (Deer Valley), AZ
82 Moriarty, NM
83 Amarillo (Tradewinds), TX
84 Stuttgart, AR
85 Cullman, AL
86 Jasper, AL
87 West Helena, AR
88 Tunica, MS
89 Mountain Home, AR
90 Russleville, AL
91 Centre, AL
92 Jamestown, KY
93 Campbellville, KY
94 Danville, IL
95 Aurora, IL
96 Delavan, WI
97 Elizabethtown, KY
98 Calhoun, GA
99 Huntingdon, TN
100 Mountain View, MO
101 Sunset Strip (Topeka), KS
102 Manhattan, KS
103 Atchison, KS
104 Kaiser Lake Ozark, MO
105 Paris, TN
106 Tullahoma, TN
107 Madison Co (Huntsville, AL)
108 Cherokee, Co (Canton, GA)
109 Triple Tree Aerodrome (Woodruff), SC)
110 Blairsville, GA
111 Baxley, GA
112 Melbourne, FL
113 Cedar Key, FL
114 Cross City, FL
115 Greenville, SC (Downtown)
116 Americus, GA
117 Asheboro, NC
118 Panama City Beach, FL
119 Morganton, NC
120 Blacksburg, VA
121 Martinsburg, WV
122 Frederick, MD
123 Middletown, DE
124 Trenton, NJ
125 Danbury, CT
126 Pawtucket, RI
127 Fitchburg, MA
128 Laconia, NH
129 Portland, ME
130 Montpelier, VT
131 Fulton, NY
132 Niagara Falls, NY
133 Erie, PA
134 Fremont, OH
135 Flint, MI
136 Michigan City, IN
137 Green Bay, WI
138 Hartford, WI
139 Hendricks CO (Indianapolis), IN
140 Rockwood, TN
141 Cartersville, GA
142 Selmer, TN
143 Corinth, MS
144 Mountain Airpark, Cleveland, GA
145 Pine Mountain, GA
146 Hampton, GA
147 Berry Hill Airport, Stockbridge, GA
148 Vidalia, GA
149 Jekyll Island, GA
150 Jesup, GA
151 Fitzgerald, GA
152 Griffin, GA
153 Demopolis, AL
154 Monroe, LA
155 Clinton, AR
156 Emporia, KS
157 Great Bend, KS
158 Imperial, NE
159 Sterling, CO
160 Laramie, WY
161 Rock Springs, WY
162 Ogden, UT
163 Twin Falls, ID
164 La Grande, OR
165 Walla Walla, WA
166 Coer D’Alene, ID
167 Helena, MT
168 Billings, MT
169 Hettinger, ND
170 Aberdeen, SD
171 Anoka, MN
172 Stevens Point, WI
173 Logansport, IN
174 Jacksboro, TN
175 Tompkinsville, TN
176 Rough River, KY
177 Dayton, TN
178 Pulaski, TN
179 Poplar Bluff, MO
180 Cape Girardeau, MO
181 Dalton, GA
182 Whispering Pines Airpark, GA
183 Douglas, GA
184 Leesburg, FL
185 Inverness, FL
186 Tifton, GA

[fastj22]

I do have on the highest airport a Waiex has been, in fact the highest in North America but it was only a 50 minute flight from my home base. Probably a 65 minute flight in a CH601.

Leadville, CO, 9980ft.

[N111YX]

You got me there. I'll make Leadville one day!

I do have on the highest airport a Waiex has been, in fact the highest in North America but it was only a 50 minute flight from my home base. Probably a 65 minute flight in a CH601.

Leadville, CO, 9980ft.

[DCASonex]

Initially bought a Zenith CH650 kit in 2008. Got tail and one wing complete when found out about folding (in flight) wing problem. Zenith initial response was bury head in sand, blame pilots, and require higher tension on aileron cables which due to bad design of bell crank mounting only increased probability of its failure. Mothballed that and bought Sonex kit as that had been my second choice and would use the Jabiru engine I had purchased for the Zenith. Unloaded the Zenith kit at about $15K loss after they eventually issued what looked to be a correction that addressed the problem. By comparison, even with the Zenith revisions, Sonex is built like a tank.

Since wife and I were interested in a plane for cross county more than aerobatics, outfitted the Sonex with, among other goodies, better upholstery and dual axis autopilot which makes it a comfortable small airliner for two not-over-sized people and is still usable in aerobatic category. Still fighting with that #%$^% Jabiru engine.

David A.

[LarryEWaiex121]

What ya think of that comment Kip?
I guess you must have "shipped your plane to Idaho" last year huh? LOL
Here I am at less than 3 yrs and almost 400 hrs. It didn't all come just going in circles.
Try 6 trips to the Washington, Oregon coast. Four trips to Boise, Nampa area. Two trips to Billings, Montana. Two trips to Sacramento/Rio LInda. That's just the ones that pop into my mind.
I've yet to fly coast to coast like you but, its a function of time and not for lack of cross country ability.
In three years time my Waiex has visited lots of places.

Larry
Coeur d Alene, Idaho
Waiex 121YX 391hrs.

[fastj22]

The Jabiru in my Waiex originated in a CH601XL. the plane had just finished its 40 hours phase 1 when the FAA grounded them for the wing problem. The owner, pulled the wings off and trailered it back to his home to install the fix over the winter. He had just finished the second wing when he had a massive stroke and passed away. His widow decided to part out the plane and the local EAA chapter disassembled it and sold off the parts. That's where my engine came from. I sent her a note after my first flight and she was delighted someone was able to use it.