Rolls and loops

[Sonex541]

I have about 70 hours in my Sonex and have been wanting to roll this dam thing since I first flew it , but I'm scared lol well not really never did a roll , how did you guys go about doin your first roll , previous aerobatic training , or just went for it , and what speed should I do a roll at , I'm sure this thing rolls easy cause it's so sensitive on the stick ,

[rizzz]

Honestly, I wouldn't do it without some aerobatics training or at least an introduction first.

My first rolls started out great but once passed the vertical the nose started to drop and they ended up looking more like loops as I came out.
The aircraft I learned in was a Citabria, high wing with lots of drag, so I didn't have to worry about going through VNE with the nose pointing straight down at an already speed. In an aircraft like the Sonex you'll see VNE in no time.

[Bryan Cotton]

I had training. Doing the roll is not hard, but knowing what to do if you screw it up is hard. With some instruction you develop a little muscle memory and instincts.

[fastj22]

As Bryan said, rolls are easy. I enter at about 130 indicated, pull up slightly then full deflection of the aileron until you complete the roll. You should get spin/unusual attitude training before you try any aerobatics. I fell out of my first loop attempt into an inverted spin.
Also, make sure you take everything loose out of the cockpit. You will find enough chaff from your build on your first few zero G maneuvers.

[radfordc]

I hate admitting that I've never had any formal aerobatic training before doing aero in my Sonex and it probably is a bad idea. I actually did my first loops and rolls in a CGS Hawk ultralight.

Yes, I have screwed up a roll in my Sonex and had to split S out of inverted...if you aren't comfortable with the thought of doing that you should get a few hours of instruction.

[kevin814]

Wow, what a coincidence! I learned to do rolls and loops in my Hawk Arrow II with a crappy Rotax 582. It was fun tossing that thing around, but it would barely do rolls. You had to have your technique down in the Hawk to do any aerobatics, it could just BARELY do them.

In the Sonex it feels like a fighter, and seems easy in comparison. I would try to avoid having negative G's. If you do the oil will be in the top of the engine and oil pressure can drop which is bad for bearings.

During a loop, as you climb, increase back stick as your speed drops to get over the top of the loop. Then when you are coming down relax back stick pressure as your speed picks up and and you pull out of the dive. I don't have a G meter (used to in the Hawk), but you can go by feel. During pull up just try to keep a consistent amount of G's pulling you down in the seat. You should be able to do a loop at around 3 G's, and they aren't that hard. I was nervous before the first one, but then I had a huge sense of relief when it was over. I was giggling doing repeated loops, only losing about 200 feet per loop. Not many things are better than a roller coaster you can control with your mind!

Kevin K

I hate admitting that I've never had any formal aerobatic training before doing aero in my Sonex and it probably is a bad idea. I actually did my first loops and rolls in a CGS Hawk ultralight.

Yes, I have screwed up a roll in my Sonex and had to split S out of inverted...if you aren't comfortable with the thought of doing that you should get a few hours of instruction.

[MichaelFarley56]

I have about 70 hours in my Sonex and have been wanting to roll this dam thing since I first flew it , but I'm scared lol well not really never did a roll , how did you guys go about doin your first roll , previous aerobatic training , or just went for it , and what speed should I do a roll at , I'm sure this thing rolls easy cause it's so sensitive on the stick ,

I truly hate sounding like Mr. Scrooge here, but if you don't have any formal acro instruction, please consider some dual training before doing this stuff on your own. As a long time CFI I've seen people get themselves in trouble by trying things with no training and, in my opinion, it's just not a smart thing to do. Our airplanes are built like tanks but they still have limits that need to be respected. I know it's a pain to find an instructor and rent an airplane now that you own one, but you'll feel much better about putting your plane through its paces after you abuse someone else's!

[radfordc]

I truly hate sounding like Mr. Scrooge here, but if you don't have any formal acro instruction, please consider some dual training before doing this stuff on your own. As a long time CFI I've seen people get themselves in trouble by trying things with no training and, in my opinion, it's just not a smart thing to do.

I agree...not a smart thing to do.

Nobody ever accused me of being overly smart. :lol:

[Sonerai13]

I agree with Mike. Doing acro in a Sonex without any proper training is a recipe for disaster. The Sonex is a very clean airframe, and it will pick up speed VERY RAPIDLY when pointed toward the ground with any power on at all. (and even with power off for that matter.) Any maneuver that gets "busted" and results in a nose-down attitude could turn into a big problem in a big hurry. Doing a Split-S out of a busted maneuver is never a good idea, and can lead to over-speed, over-stress, and/or G-LOC in no time. None of these are good things.

Be careful. Be smart. Be safe.

[vigilant104]

I have a bit of acro experience, but it is in very different aircraft and was a long time ago. I don't plan to do acro in my Sonex until I've had some refresher training, and that includes plenty of spins. Spin recovery used to be nearly second nature for me, but I recognize that this is a different plane and that I'm no longer current. It takes very little for a simple maneuver to become a busted one, and then things can get interesting

I'd think that energy management in the Sonex is key to good, safe acro. With just 80 HP, I know I won't be able to count on a lot of thrust to pull me through a maneuver, I'll need to have almost all the energy needed when I start. On the other side, getting the nose low will lead to a rapid increase in speed, something that will require a lot of attention. On the plus side, the crisp roll rate is a big plus.

Just my uninformed opinion.