Buying a partially completed project

[Idunno]

I'm currently weighing my options as far as buying a new kit, or a partially completed one. A Sonex has come up for sale in my area, and I am considering checking into it. What are some builder's opinions on this? It is listed as completed wings, fuselage, and tail. I'd like to find one with less completed (I want to build too), but the price may be right, and it's nearby. How much can be inspected on a project at this stage? Are there critical parts that will not be accessible to inspect? Anything in particular to look for? Any other advice?

Thanks!

[Sonex1517]

I am certain you will get a variety of responses, but here are some things to consider, many of which you are likely aware of.

> You may not qualify for the repairman certificate unless you can prove you built 51% of the aircraft.
> Once the wings are closed up it is extremely difficult to determine the quality of work done internally. Things I would be thinking about here are how well the ribs are built if they are scratch built, or how well are they riveted to the spar if it is a kit or scratch built. There are a lot of internal structures in the wings you will be unable to inspect, thus leaving you to assume the state of construction.

Having said that, unless you see obviously poor construction technique elsewhere it may be that the inside of the wings are fine.

> The tail has similar structural assembly that is difficult or impossible to inspect after closing it up.

We have a pre-purchase guide here http://sonexfoundation.com/Pre-Purchase_Inspection.html that could prove useful.

Good luck and I hope we see you in a Sonex regardless of if you build or buy!


Robbie Culver
Sonex 1517
Chicagoland
Tails and Wings complete - finishing fuselage.
N1517S reserved

[Idunno]

Thanks for the response, Robbie. I am aware of the repairman's certificate issue, a call to the fsdo would probably tell me whether it is a possibility, my guess is that with that much complete, it is probably not. I'll look through the pre-purchase guide. Good tips on what can be inspected. Is the fuselage more accessible for inspection?

Thanks again

[Sonex1517]

Depending on how far the fuselage is, it is definitely more accessible. If the rear floor is not on you can get up inside the whole thing.

And you are welcome! Glad to see you here on the forum.


Robbie Culver
Sonex 1517
Chicagoland
Tails and Wings complete - finishing fuselage.
N1517S reserved

[vicdelgado9]

Seeking clarification on purchasing an experimental project already built. I was under the impression, that even if someone else built it, and you finish it out (or it is already completed), it is still an experimental aircraft which means you can perform maintainence and repairs on it, you just cannot perform the condition inspection on it. Only the person that holds the repairmans certificate or an A&P can perform the condition inspection. Correct me if I am wrong on that please.

[fastj22]

Seeking clarification on purchasing an experimental project already built. I was under the impression, that even if someone else built it, and you finish it out (or it is already completed), it is still an experimental aircraft which means you can perform maintainence and repairs on it, you just cannot perform the condition inspection on it. Only the person that holds the repairmans certificate or an A&P can perform the condition inspection. Correct me if I am wrong on that please.

That is correct. The only thing the repairmans certificate buys you is free conditional inspections.

[Sonerai13]

Seeking clarification on purchasing an experimental project already built. I was under the impression, that even if someone else built it, and you finish it out (or it is already completed), it is still an experimental aircraft which means you can perform maintainence and repairs on it, you just cannot perform the condition inspection on it. Only the person that holds the repairmans certificate or an A&P can perform the condition inspection. Correct me if I am wrong on that please.

That is correct. The only thing the repairmans certificate buys you is free conditional inspections.

Yes, in typical FAA fashion, the "repairman certificate" for an experimental amateur-built aircraft has nothing to do with repairing the aircraft! The only time the repairman certificate is required is when performing the condition inspection each year. No certificate is necessary when performing maintenance, repair or modification. In fact, no FAA certificate of any kind is required for these tasks. You don't have to be the builder, you don't have to be the owner, you don't have to be a pilot, you don't have to...well, you get the idea. ANYONE can perform these functions. The person operating the aircraft on any given flight is responsible to make sure the aircraft is in a condition for safe operation for that flight. The person performing the condition inspection each year must hold either the repairman certificate for that individual aircraft, or an A&P mechanic certificate.

And speaking of condition inspections, there is nothing "conditional" about them. You are inspecting the condition of the aircraft, so it is a condition inspection (per the wording in the operating limitations).

[Idunno]

Thanks again for the tips. I don't yet know much about this project, but is there a list of revision history for the Sonex? Are early plans/kits the same as later ones? Will Sonex support updates for older kits?

[Bryan Cotton]

Drawing revisions:
http://www.sonexaircraft.com/support/drawingrevs.html
Service bulletins:
http://www.sonexaircraft.com/support/se ... etins.html

They have you covered!