Crash Data, Discussion, Diagnosis, and Dialogue

[Tigers2007]

Would it be possible to create a section to discuss factual and documented crashes of Sonex aircraft? I am a very serious potential first time builder and after briefly reviewing the NTSB notes for many incidents, I have questions. Most recently, does anyone have a clue or suggestion to how Richard Binkley's Jaibaru 3300 powered bird went down? Anyone know this guy?

[N111YX]

I did know the pilot of the Binkley Sonex. It's doubtful that the accident will ever have a definate cause assigned to it as there was not much left of the wreckage to work with. Based on witness accounts, the most likely situation was and engine problem with a stall spin. However, I feel that other factors could have played in also. I'd rather not say as it's just more speculation but I don't feel that it was the result of any fault of the Sonex design...

[MichaelFarley56]

Back in the day, I used to enjoy reading the Flying magazine column titled "I Learned About Flying From That" where people would write in articles of their own close calls, I believe written as both entertainment as well as peer education.

Perhaps we could modify this idea to include our own members personal stories of "issues" we've had while flying as well as discussing Sonex accidents. That way things may not be so depressing :mrgreen:

Just a thought...

[fastj22]

I read the NTSB reports weekly. There's a lot of "Don't go there" stuff. Most are just pilot error and we need to learn from their mistakes.
What I find frustrating is the length of time the final reports come out.
Still waiting for the root cause of the Waiex that went down in Oct 2011 due to an in flight break up. Sonex sent us a fix which I've installed, but I'd sure like to know the reason for it. Its been 15 months since the incident.

[N111YX]

I hear ya. We were supposed to have the final report in time for "the holidays" according to a few Waiex pilots that have been in contact with the officials. Maybe they meant Easter... :?

I read the NTSB reports weekly. There's a lot of "Don't go there" stuff. Most are just pilot error and we need to learn from their mistakes.
What I find frustrating is the length of time the final reports come out.
Still waiting for the root cause of the Waiex that went down in Oct 2011 due to an in flight break up. Sonex sent us a fix which I've installed, but I'd sure like to know the reason for it. Its been 15 months since the incident.

[EricS]

Still waiting for the root cause of the Waiex that went down in Oct 2011 due to an in flight break up. Sonex sent us a fix which I've installed, but I'd sure like to know the reason for it. Its been 15 months since the incident.

When I was at the Sonex builder's workshop in October I asked John about the Waiex tail service bulletin and if there was a link to the Oct. 2011 crash. He said the crash investigation prompted them to review the "new standards" (I'm assuming he's talking about the ASTM standards that had been revised since the aircraft was designed...) in relation to the Waiex design. They determined that the standards required them to increase the strength of the "Y" tail support structure and that it had nothing to do with the actual inflight breakup.

It will be interesting to see what is concluded in the final report

[Tigers2007]

I did notice that most of the NTSB items were associated with pilot error and of course, most were attributed to running out of fuel. Thanks for the dialogue regarding this. I think it would be great to have a dedicated section for critical issues; almost like our own AD area or at least a place to discuss scarey incidents. Its easier for us to discuss it here rather than wait for the factory to issue a notice. As a very new person to this, my impression is that this is a fantastic aircraft and I can't wait to build one. I've been lurking around many forums and trying to read up on all of the many small homebuilts and this seems to be one of the nicest out there.

[Tigers2007]

Since I created this post, there have been four accidents reported to the NTSB in Sonex aircraft.

05/26/2013 - Loss of engine power, 34hrs TT on AeroVee 2180, non-fatal

09/06/2013 - Preliminary report, loss of engine power, unknown engine type, non-fatal

10/15/2013 - Loss of engine power, 30hrs TT Great Planes 2180 factory overhauled per report, non-fatal

02/17/2014 - Preliminary report, loss of engine power "backfired and sputtered" prior to impact per report, AeroVee 2180? fatal

I'm very blown away that every one of these had to do with "loss of engine power". The 02/17 accident photos seem to indicate this was the AeroVee 2180. I'm very curious to what the results of the 09/05/2013 and the fatal accident will be in regards to what went wrong with the motor. On a side note - I was involved in an "event" due to loss of engine power in my Cessna. Mine was due to carb icing thanks to mother nature, Continental's sharp design, and my non-aggressive use of Carb heat prior to takeoff.

[fastj22]

The 9/6 report hasn't been released, but he did post on the yahoo forum that it was a fuel injected Jabiru 3300 that lost the crank sensor wire.

[Tigers2007]

Holy crap - losing a single wire brought down the bird? I remember cleaning up the wire ends on my Cessna by crimping, soldering, and sealing with double-wall heat shrink. It is what I was taught in high school and what I always do with all automotive wiring. I couldn't believe the flimsy crimps that on this bird. After my carb icing incident I swore I would go Lycoming or FI only. Now I learned a critical failure point for FI motors. Maybe I can throw together a spreadsheet of all Sonex reported (and unreported) incidents/accidents. This would be a neat discussion topic and training class at an annual Sonex meetup. Regardless, it won't hold me back from buying a kit. I'll tell you what though, the only reason I'm typing this message today is because the airport I was based out of had a 5500ft runway. Any less, like two hundred or so, this would have been done by my ghost-writer :roll:. I won't wish that experience upon my worst enemy. It was good experience though. If anything is suspected and you still think you got enough runway left, put her down quick.