Sonex vs Waiex, plans vs kit

[Idunno]

Hello everyone,

I've been wanting to build a plane for quite a while, and am closing in on my decision of what to build. I think that the Sonex/Waiex makes a lot of sense for me. I like most things about it. My problem is that I like the looks of the Waiex version much better, but I like the option of building more parts from plans to save some money.


Are the Waiex plans as complete as the Sonex? Looking at the Sonex website, it looks like you could buy the component kits for the tail and fuselage, but scratch build the wing. How does Sonex control that the Waiex is only built from a complete kit?


Secondly, I've read some comments about the Waiex turing out heavier. Does anyone here have any detail on that? Is there a good source of data for customer completed weights vs factory claimed weight?

Thanks in advance

[dcstrng]

Are the Waiex plans as complete as the Sonex? ... How does Sonex control that the Waiex is only built from a complete kit?
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From the website: The Waiex is only available in kit form. The Waiex complete kit includes many pre-fabricated precision parts. [however] the Sonex can be built from scratch using plans, or using our complete kit, which includes many pre-fabricated precision parts.

I don’t know what Waiex plans look like, but I believe the plans are only sold with the kit… the Sonex plans are some of the most complete I’ve seen in homebuilding (says he who has $pent far more on various plans than anyone ever should…)

[fastj22]

Yes, the Waiex is kit only, no plans building. When you buy the entire kit, you get the complete plans. If you buy a sub-kit (tail, wings, fuselage), you get only the plans for that sub-kit. This is to keep you from just buying the tail kit then scratch build from that point on. I'm not sure if you buy a Sonex tail kit, it includes all the plans. Once you have all the sub-kits, you will have a complete set of plans. The plans are just as detailed as the scratch build plans, this is so you can re-work any kit part you might damage.

You technically could scratch build another Waiex from them (less the spar caps) but you would be violating the license.

As for weight, I think they are a bit heavier due to the ruddervator mixer and tail mods to strenghten the attach points. Mixer forward, they are identical.

[Idunno]

Ah, that makes sense.

I also found a list of weights and configurations on the yahoo list today. I'll look through that and see what I learn.

Does anyone have any input as far as kit vs plans, time or money saved? Are there any sections that are particularly good or bad deals for time saved vs money spent?

Thanks again

[fastj22]

I have a Waiex, therefore I am a kit builder by default. I also got the machined angle option. This reduced fabrication significantly and saved hundreds of hours and rework. Mine didn't have the match-holed parts the new kits. So if you bought every option, match-holed parts, machine angle components and the pre-built spars, there would be little fabrication and just assembly.

Obviously, plans builders have to fabricate everything from raw materials. My hat is off to them.

The question you have to ask yourself, do you really enjoy fabrication and don't mind spending a great deal of time doing it? Or is your time valuable to you and you just want to assemble your own airplane and get flying. Or is it somewhere in the middle? Are you budget minded or time minded?

I was near the end of my project when I really got tired of some of the tedious fabrication, screwed up a part and got so burned out and took several months off.

[Idunno]

Yeah, I'm somewhere in the middle, I enjoy fabrication and that's one reason I want to build, but I want to finish in a timely manner as well. I'm just trying to justify to the rational part of me that I should spend more money for less payload capability because it looks better.

[MichaelFarley56]

This is an excellent question! First, like others have said, the Sonex plans contain everything you would need to scratch build the entire airplane. On the other hand, while the Waiex plans are very similar in design and appearance to the Sonex plans, there are parts depicted in the Waiex plans that don't have dimensions, thus making them impossible to fabricate from scratch. Also, like others have said, Sonex llc will only deliver Waiex plans to people who purchase the kit.

There are people out there who enjoy the challenge of scratch building, but it does without question add a lot of time to the build. If you're the sort of guy who likes building then great! I for one enjoyed the construction of my Waiex, but I enjoy the flying much more. If you're like me, at least buy the kit and if you can afford it, the pre-assembled angle kit is also a good investment. It will make the build all that much faster. The pre-assembled spars are nice, but it's not challenging to build the spars, just a little time consuming. If I had to choose, I would buy the pre-assembled angle kit first.

Best of luck on your decision, which ever you decide to do!

[fastj22]

We are talking a few pounds, not 10s of lbs difference in weight. The yahoo spreadsheet should give you a good idea. But keep in mind us Waiex guys tend to bling out our birds because we like to be a bit different. Those conventional tail guys are, well, conventional. 8-)

Also consider ramp appeal. If you like attention, pull up at the FBO or fuel dock and you will definitely get more attention in a Waiex.

And when I mention fabrication, I'm talking about taking a raw stick of channel or sheet of metal, transferring a pattern on it, cutting it out, finishing the edges, marking and drilling the pilot holes, then chucking it in the recycle bin because you made the mirror image of the part you needed. Even if you buy the machined angles, you will remake a few of them. Things happen.

[rizzz]

And when I mention fabrication, I'm talking about taking a raw stick of channel or sheet of metal, transferring a pattern on it, cutting it out, finishing the edges, marking and drilling the pilot holes, then chucking it in the recycle bin because you made the mirror image of the part you needed. Even if you buy the machined angles, you will remake a few of them. Things happen.

Yep, been there done that:


Anyway,
Bear in mind as well that there are various degrees of "scratch building", Sonex sells every part they have in their kits separately (here: http://www.sonexaircraft.com/kits/scratch.html) so you can choose to make the parts you wish to make and buy the ones you wish to buy.
Many "scratch builders" still buy things like the flap/aileron skins + aft wing spars (to avoid the need to make a special brake to bend these), welded steel components (not everybody is capable of welding), fiberglass components (making fiberglass parts is very different and cab get very messy), and much more...

[fastj22]

Michael, being down under don't you have to do everything upside down too? So confusing.