Sonex #800 Hydraulic Brakes

[falvarez]

I received my Landing Gear / Brake order from Sonex today and I thought I'd share a picture with the group of the new hydraulic brakes. I plan on installing the gear / brakes over the next couple weeks and I'll provide additional pictures of the installation as I work through it.

Below is a picture of the Hydraulic Brake parts that I received from Sonex. I purchased the hydraulic break kit as well as the master cylinder kit. My order also included all the other landing gear parts such as wheels and titanium rods. I figure that the by purchasing the new hydraulic brakes and master cylinder from Sonex, it cost me about $100 more than what the drum brake kit plus machined drums would have cost....that's pretty cheap, in my opinion, to get hydraulic brakes on a Sonex. And my understanding is that these don't really add any extra weight...we'll have to see about performance when we get there.

Hydraulic Brake Kit

Brakes.jpg (229.12 KiB) Viewed 6104 times

The parts looks great and appear to be high quality...the kit looks to be very complete. However, I elected not to get the Sonex installation kit for the new brakes. The install is pretty basic and I have plenty of spare materials laying around. The only issue is that the plans page with the details are included with the installation kit...not a big deal, but just an FYI to anyone else purchasing the brakes.

Also, I'm going to be using the larger Van's tailwheel along with Kip's tailwheel bracket. Below is a picture of the what I'll be working through over the next couple weeks.

Landing Gear.jpg (215.33 KiB) Viewed 6104 times

I'll upload more picks of the brakes in the next week or so.

[N111YX]

Looking forward to a report, Frank. I'm so tired of my slow-down, main gear shimmys...:(

Sweet tailwheel, too.:)

Don't forget to consider using this means of axle drilling...

viewtopic.php?f=33&t=126

[falvarez]

I saw on SonexTalk a question regarding how long it takes to install the new Hydraulic Brakes from Sonex....I would have posted my information sooner, but I realized that I need to get my firewall further along so that I can do the final install of my engine mount / gear...otherwise; I'd need to drain the hydraulic fluid and redo the brakes each time I remove the engine mount. So I have done the install...it just isn't final yet....

To answer the question regarding how long to install...if you have the Sonex / Waiex mounting kit, I don't see why this would take you more than a day. If you have to fabricate the few parts needed for the install you may need an extra day.

The install is easy and straightforward...but as with the first run of anything, there were a few typos in the instructions. Here are a few things I noted (as of when I received my brakes...these may have been corrected since) as well as a couple pictures:

1) The new plans sheet required for the install the new brakes are only included with the Sonex / Waiex mounting kit; however, Sonex was happy to email me a PDF copy.

2) The mounting bolts (both for the axle and backing plate) should be AN4, not the AN3 called out in the plans.

3) Most of the dimensions from the backing plate are not provided...I'm assuming this is so that you can customize the plate to the particular wheel pant. One item to note here...in the picture, you'll see that my plate looks slightly different than the plans one. I feel that the backing plate should be level with the ground when the plane is in a level attitude...I don't see how you could achieve this using the bolt hole layout in the plans; therefore, mine are modified.

4) You'll need to cut down the existing Brake Handle to match the new master cylinder. I got lucky and the mounting hole I was using was at a good location for the new brakes. You have to add a second hole to the handle, and you will need to watch the edge distance on the second hole...but for me it worked out fine. It depends on how much you want the handle angled back.

5) Like other builders have mentioned...I needed to add a small spacer (~1/16") between the brakes and the wheel. Per Sonex, the other option is to take 1/16" off the brake disks, but I prefer the spacer.

Overall, I'm extremely impressed with the new brakes and based on the flight reports coming back for them, they are a huge improvement over the drums.

Brake Parts - Showing my modified backing plate

Brake Parts.jpg (159.48 KiB) Viewed 5941 times

Brakes mounted on axle

Brake Assembly 1.jpg (110.06 KiB) Viewed 5941 times

Brakes with wheel installed

Brake Assembly 2.jpg (127.76 KiB) Viewed 5941 times

Master Cylinder

Master Cylinder.jpg (120.24 KiB) Viewed 5941 times

[EricS]

Thanks for the update Frank! Your install looks great.

[142YX]

I have just started taking a good look at my brake kit too, and planning the installation is now on my short list. I am going to go with a toe brake, two master cylinder system. Haven’t committed on a toe pedal design yet, but the one that #1327 David posted on the planholders yahoo group looks really nice.. I am thinking my layout will be very similar to his.

[Mike53]

I have just started taking a good look at my brake kit too, and planning the installation is now on my short list. I am going to go with a toe brake, two master cylinder system. Haven’t committed on a toe pedal design yet, but the one that #1327 David posted on the planholders yahoo group looks really nice.. I am thinking my layout will be very similar to his.

Could you possibly supply a link to that?I am convinced I am going to want toe brakes and would like to see anyones ideas.
Thanks,
Mike Onex 080

[MichaelFarley56]

Thanks for the posting Frank! Very clean looking install...I'm very impressed! As soon as a toe brake system comes out for independent brakes I will be all over it. Just like Kip, I'm tired of a squeaking, shimmy on landing issue that everyone else has.

Just out of curiosity, have you tried to fit the wheel pants over the back plate? And just to clarify, I see you have three holes around the axles. Are those pre drilled in the kit or did you do those? I'm curious how they were modified.

Thanks!

[falvarez]

Even though I'll be staying with the brake lever, I'm hoping we can get someone to post pictures of their toe break install. A while back I had researched creating toe brakes and it does not look very hard...I've seen a few great examples on Sonex / Waiex; however, I deleted all those references a while back. Also, Sonex does not include the Master Cylinder that I used in their Hydraulic Brake Kit (it's an add-on accessory from them) so you won't have to worry about buying a master cylinder that you won't end up using.

Regarding the 3 holes that you commented on...that's where I disagree with what I've seen in the plans. There are 4 holes in the Brake Cylinder and 1 hold on the axle (this is a standard Sonex axle)...so the angle of the Brake Cylinder relative to the axle is fixed. The backing plate can be rotated / raised / lowered depending on where you locate the holes. My understanding is that if you buy the installation kit, these holes are drilled for you as well. I haven't fit the wheel pants to the wheels yet as I'm scratch building the fiberglass parts as I go; however, in my opinion wheel pants should be installed so they are level when the plane is in a level attitude, so I'd expect the backing plate to be the same. The only real issue was that I needed to cut down my backing plate some to make it easier to bleed the brakes. And if I'm wrong here, its just a piece of .063 plate so I can whip an new one pretty quick.

[142YX]

I have just started taking a good look at my brake kit too, and planning the installation is now on my short list. I am going to go with a toe brake, two master cylinder system. Haven’t committed on a toe pedal design yet, but the one that #1327 David posted on the planholders yahoo group looks really nice.. I am thinking my layout will be very similar to his.

Could you possibly supply a link to that?I am convinced I am going to want toe brakes and would like to see anyones ideas.
Thanks,
Mike Onex 080

I feel a little weird about taking them down off the yahoo group and posting them here because they aren't mine to distribute.. but if you go to the SonexPlanholders yahoo group, click on "files", within the folder marked "Modifications to Sonex # 1327", and then within the folder marked "Brakes and wheels". He has posted a wealth of information on all of the mods that he made to his airplane.. a real quality build.

I maintain my opinion that those yahoo groups are convoluted and a silly way to interact with people on the internet.. still hoping that the flock migrates over here to this forum (that is.. if we can get our own search feature to work correctly! :? )