SonexBuilders.net

Hello everyone,

I have decided to join the boards, because I have had my eye on building an aircraft since flying with my ground instructor's husband in their RV-4. I have been into aviation my whole life. My dad took me to the Chicago Air and Water show every year since I can remember, I spent a lot of time in the auto shop during high school and joined the Air Force to be an aircraft mechanic when I graduated. When I first joined I wanted to get my degree and eventually try and commission to be a pilot, but I let fear of online school and some bad flight chiefs keep me out of school. I have always enjoyed working as a mechanic, and I had a pretty cool job working on F-15 Eagles down in FL. During my time in FL, I worked on the flight line for about three years and then got to work in the phase hangar for a year.

When I knew my time in FL was coming to an end, I put an application together and was selected to be a mechanic on the Thunderbirds. I also meet my wife during this time and our first Christmas together she bought me an introductory ride in a Cirrus 20 out in Las Vegas. I really enjoyed the flight, and decided I was going to pursue my PPL which I put on hold due to limited time with the fast pace of my assignment on the Thunderbirds. I worked a couple of jobs while on the Thunderbirds, spent some time on the air show circuit and got to meet some cool pilots who got me interested in flying Aerobatics, the back seat ride in the F-16 helped a little as well. I also started working on a BS in Aeronautics with a minor in aviation safety at ERAU, and plan on applying for a commission, if I'm not to old, when I finish my degree.

At the end of my time with the Thunderbirds, I moved to California and now work on the U-2. One of the first things I did after my move was to sign up for the ground school course that the base aero club put on, and started flying! While I have fallen short of my goal to be an Air Force pilot, I have achieved the next best thing...learning to fly from some U-2 pilots! For those of you who do not know, the U-2 is considered one of the hardest aircraft to land, and I have consider my self blessed to have had the opportunity of flying with two great CFI's to get me started off on the right foot. I was able to fly 13.1 flt hours so far and the last .5 was my solo flight in a Cessna 172R. Unfortunately I had to put my training on hold for a deployment but I will be back at the controls soon and I am very excited to finish. Given that the U-2 is an older design compared to F-16s and F-15s I used to work on, working this aircraft has given me the confidence that I could successfully/safely build my own aircraft. After seeing that white collar guys with next to no previous mechanical experience have built experimental home builds with a relatively high degree of safety, I decided I can to.

One of the reasons I decided to go with a homebuilt aircraft is because I want to fly aerobatics, and I will probably never be able to afford a certified aerobatic plane. I am also very attracted to the thought of low fuel burn so I can fly more. My ground instructor and her husband purchased a low time RV and have had a few electrical issues which drives me to the decision to build over buy, I like the fact that after building I can self maintain and self inspect, and I enjoy building stuff in the garage so it really cemented my plan to build my own. At first I was thinking about building an RV-8, but that is a little out of my short term price range and after doing some more research I decided the Sonex is the right fit for me. Originally I was thinking a Onex, but my CFI convinced me that flying alone is boring and it would be better to go with a 2 seat plane, and I am also a father of twins so it can be a good opportunity to spend time with just my son or my daughter while teaching them about aviation and exploring some expensive ice cream options.

I plan to go with the original Sonex model as a tail dragger, w/ center stick, hydraulic brakes, and built in the sport acro configuration. I am considering a Turbo AeroVee with one of the lite MGL screens. I was thinking about saving up for the full kit, but after looking around on this forum, I am thinking about doing a partial scratch build, and building parts as I have money and time to stay focused on my goal and then I can say that I am building an airplane instead of I am going to build an airplane.

Well this turned out to be a lot longer than I originally intended, but thanks for reading, and I look forward to learning with this community.

Welcome to the forums! A guy in my first glider club flew U2's and an old timer in my second glider club was a CC for the Tbirds. If you have young kids I would definitely go Sonex over Onex.

Welcome to the forums! I was a crew chief on F-15s F-16s F-4s and A-10s. Try to get some time in a glider or a Taildragger while you're working on your license, it really helps you understand what your feet are really for while you're flying. I chose the OneX because I wanted a toy that was harder to break while I'm playing with it and my daughter has grown up and moved into her own place. I have the Turbo Aerovee because my elevation is at 4000 feet and regularly it's over 100° in the summertime plus I want high altitude cruise speeds. I'm going to get the plans only Sonex as well so I can do a slow build to get a 2 place aircraft with a decent cruise speed too.

I read this forum every morning to keep me wanting to get out there and work on my aircraft. If you have the time the Sonex training is worth every penny you put into it. Shows you just how easy it really is to build this aircraft.
Have fun!

I'm building a Onex and if I want to take a Pax, I rent a Tecnam from a local FBO. Sort of like having my sports car for me and an SUV for the family. I can keep the Onex in a shared hangar at the same airport.

Cheers

Hello New Guy, and welcome to the club. According to your introduction letter, you must have spent a lot of time in the Las Vegas area, working with the thunderbirds and all. So To tell you a little about myself, I live in Las Vegas. I am building a Waiex, which is a Sonex except with a V tail. I chose the Waiex because of it's V tail. I have a lot of hours in Bonanza's and just like the looks of the V tail, anyway Let me tell you right off that you may, like me, get discouraged about half way through with building the fuselage and decide to just quit. I think I have gotten to that point at least 3 times, but along the line someone in our group gives me a little pep talk and I keep building. I am getting old and have a lot of aches and pains, so I have advertised what I have completed for sale due to that fact, but as long as the airplane is still in my garage, I will continue to work on it, and you never know, if I don't get an offer on it, I may even finish the build. I have over 5000 hours of flight time logged, mostly military time in Choppers, and I really miss flying. That's the reason I'm keeping at the build. So anyway, again, welcome, and if I can help you with getting started, when you get your first kit, just let me know.

AL Roberts Waiex#0209

crewchief2pilot wrote:Hello everyone,

I plan to go with the original Sonex model as a tail dragger, w/ center stick, hydraulic brakes, and built in the sport acro configuration. I am considering a Turbo AeroVee with one of the lite MGL screens. I was thinking about saving up for the full kit, but after looking around on this forum, I am thinking about doing a partial scratch build, and building parts as I have money and time to stay focused on my goal and then I can say that I am building an airplane instead of I am going to build an airplane.

Welcome! Very cool credentials :-) A few bullet points I'll throw out:

1. Center stick: if you are going to fly with a passenger then you might want to try sitting in someone else's Sonex with a center stick. I recently flew a center stick from the center. On the ground, for giggles, I sat on one side and tried to operate the stick with someone seated next to me. Very difficult to get the stick to go full left/right. My personal preference would be to use a center stick only if I were flying alone. I have dual sticks and fly solo aerobatics. There really isn't a downside to flying aerobatics from the left instead of the center.

2. I could not afford the kit so scratch built. I'm not so sure I saved money in the end, but I was able to make a LOT of parts for cheap for the first year, and as my finances improved along the way I was able to make it all work. It took me 5 years, 3 months, 2,360 hours, including the AeroVee build. Very rewarding.

3. I have the MGL Mini Extreme and love it! Compact and full of features, including all my flight instruments and engine monitoring for all 4 cylinders (EGT/CHT).

4. Build at home as long as you possibly can! Once you move to a hangar, even if it is close by, it changes EVERYTHING!

Ask lots of questions, and have fun!

mike.smith wrote:
4. Build at home as long as you possibly can! Once you move to a hangar, even if it is close by, it changes EVERYTHING!

I've found this point to be exceedingly true. I really miss building in my basement. I didn't realize how much time I was saving by just going down and working/looking/thinking with the plane at home. Now that it's at the hangar nearing completion, my overall time spent is far less productive.

Bryan Cotton wrote:Welcome to the forums! A guy in my first glider club flew U2's and an old timer in my second glider club was a CC for the Tbirds. If you have young kids I would definitely go Sonex over Onex.

Thank you, I am pretty much solid on the Sonex over the Onex for the sake of brining my kids along, and so that I can have an instructor with me when I start learning Aerobatics. I doubt I will be able to be in the Aerobatic category with a second person in the aircraft with me, but I can at least learn enough in the utility category so that I can get my self out of any trouble that I get my self into.

jerryhain wrote:Welcome to the forums! I was a crew chief on F-15s F-16s F-4s and A-10s. Try to get some time in a glider or a Taildragger while you're working on your license, it really helps you understand what your feet are really for while you're flying. I chose the OneX because I wanted a toy that was harder to break while I'm playing with it and my daughter has grown up and moved into her own place. I have the Turbo Aerovee because my elevation is at 4000 feet and regularly it's over 100° in the summertime plus I want high altitude cruise speeds. I'm going to get the plans only Sonex as well so I can do a slow build to get a 2 place aircraft with a decent cruise speed too.

I read this forum every morning to keep me wanting to get out there and work on my aircraft. If you have the time the Sonex training is worth every penny you put into it. Shows you just how easy it really is to build this aircraft.
Have fun!

Getting some time in a glider has been on my bucket list. After I finish my PPL I was going to try and get into doing some gliding. I will have to figure out what I will do for the taildragger time as my club doesn't have one, but then again we don't have a glider either. My budget is going to limit what I can and can't do. I want to build flight time and get my commercial and CFI so that I can try and build enough flight time while I am active duty to be close to eligible for the airlines when I retire. I just got a bonus and gave my kids my GI bill so I am hooked until 15 years, but depending on what job my wife gets when she finishes her masters, I may go guard at 15 so I can pursue a flying career and keep most of my retirement for when I am older. With that said, I will probably be spending a lot of time in the club's cardinal building complex time and working on my IFR rating.

x3 skier wrote:I'm building a Onex and if I want to take a Pax, I rent a Tecnam from a local FBO. Sort of like having my sports car for me and an SUV for the family. I can keep the Onex in a shared hangar at the same airport.

Cheers

I had thought about that as well, but I t

aferddaberts wrote:Hello New Guy, and welcome to the club. According to your introduction letter, you must have spent a lot of time in the Las Vegas area, working with the thunderbirds and all. So To tell you a little about myself, I live in Las Vegas. I am building a Waiex, which is a Sonex except with a V tail. I chose the Waiex because of it's V tail. I have a lot of hours in Bonanza's and just like the looks of the V tail, anyway Let me tell you right off that you may, like me, get discouraged about half way through with building the fuselage and decide to just quit. I think I have gotten to that point at least 3 times, but along the line someone in our group gives me a little pep talk and I keep building. I am getting old and have a lot of aches and pains, so I have advertised what I have completed for sale due to that fact, but as long as the airplane is still in my garage, I will continue to work on it, and you never know, if I don't get an offer on it, I may even finish the build. I have over 5000 hours of flight time logged, mostly military time in Choppers, and I really miss flying. That's the reason I'm keeping at the build. So anyway, again, welcome, and if I can help you with getting started, when you get your first kit, just let me know.

AL Roberts Waiex#0209

hink for the purpose that I want to build the pane, a 2 seater works out better for my situation.

Thanks for the reply, I was in vegas for about 4 years, but I was in and out a lot. I spent probably about a 1/3 of the time on the road, which would have been longer if it wasn't for sequestration. I'm sorry to hear that your thinking about getting rid of it. I wouldn't let the aches and pains get you down though. You might as well finish it and enjoy flying again... It will probably keep your feeling young!

mike.smith wrote:

crewchief2pilot wrote:Hello everyone,

I plan to go with the original Sonex model as a tail dragger, w/ center stick, hydraulic brakes, and built in the sport acro configuration. I am considering a Turbo AeroVee with one of the lite MGL screens. I was thinking about saving up for the full kit, but after looking around on this forum, I am thinking about doing a partial scratch build, and building parts as I have money and time to stay focused on my goal and then I can say that I am building an airplane instead of I am going to build an airplane.

Welcome! Very cool credentials :-) A few bullet points I'll throw out:

1. Center stick: if you are going to fly with a passenger then you might want to try sitting in someone else's Sonex with a center stick. I recently flew a center stick from the center. On the ground, for giggles, I sat on one side and tried to operate the stick with someone seated next to me. Very difficult to get the stick to go full left/right. My personal preference would be to use a center stick only if I were flying alone. I have dual sticks and fly solo aerobatics. There really isn't a downside to flying aerobatics from the left instead of the center.

2. I could not afford the kit so scratch built. I'm not so sure I saved money in the end, but I was able to make a LOT of parts for cheap for the first year, and as my finances improved along the way I was able to make it all work. It took me 5 years, 3 months, 2,360 hours, including the AeroVee build. Very rewarding.

3. I have the MGL Mini Extreme and love it! Compact and full of features, including all my flight instruments and engine monitoring for all 4 cylinders (EGT/CHT).

4. Build at home as long as you possibly can! Once you move to a hangar, even if it is close by, it changes EVERYTHING!

Ask lots of questions, and have fun!

Thank you for the advice. I was not thinking about the center stick to sit in the middle. I plan to fly from the left seat all the time. I wanted it more to have a side stick than a center stick. I was going to install an armrest in the middle so when i am flying cross country I can just kind of cruise! Plus when I got to take control of the Viper, I really liked having the throttle on the left and the side stick on the right. Having the armrest made it pretty easy, but then again the stick barely moves so I will have to see. I think I saw a few builders around me on the Sonex website, I might try reaching out to them and seeing if I can check it out. I also wanted the center stick so that when my kids are smaller i can take them and not have to worry about them trying to play with their own stick. I flew one of my instructors Eagle 150, and it has a side stick with 2 grips so that you can transfer control of the aircraft without letting go of the controls. I was going to get something similar to that, so that I can maintain control of the throttle and let my kids experiment with the controls while keeping a hand on the stick to keep things safe. I may have to rethink that, because not having full control left or right could get dangerous in a crosswind.

2. I am thinking the same thing with the scratch building. I will mainly be doing it to be doing something as funds are available. When I was younger I did a lot of wood working with my grandpa, and before this deployment I started buying some tools so I could build a storage bed for my wife. I plan on buying the tools that I need to fab parts that I will have use for again like a band saw and probably a lot of other things. That way I can stamp out my own parts when I have time and money and then anything that requires a tool I would not reuse in future will get purchased from Sonex. Buying a full kit, I think I will be financially ready to start that in about 3 years from now. So I can probably stamp out some parts, and learn/refine the skills I need to build in the mean time.

3. I was thinking about the MGL mini Extreme as well, but I really want to use the plane to teach my kids about aviation, so then I would need a second screen and I figure I might as well just get one big one that they can see from the right seat. It will be marginally more expensive, but then I also have more available to me and I am sure my kids will enjoy watching the plane move over the map. They are 1 now, so I figure they will be about 5 or 6 when I am flying.

4. I do plan to build almost entirely at home. I live on base, and I can probably get permission to take off and fly it to the airport I will keep it at when it is finished. But that will also depend on how much equipment I need to mount the wings and finish completion. I plan to build it 100% - wings attached in my garage. I am going to explore the possibility of a quick disconnect system for any electronics and flight controls in the wings so that I can ship it in a container if I needed to PCS and move it on the ground. One of my biggest concerns with starting this project is having to move in the middle of the build. I have been in for almost 10 years with no short tour, so I am sure one is heading my way. Hopefully I can return to the same base that I am at now in which case I just lose a year of building, but if I have to move that could get chaotic. I may just stamp out parts and get the organized by section in bins, wait to move and then start building. I am almost 2 years into my current assignment and so far i have been at a base for 4 years until I moved.

Rynoth wrote:

mike.smith wrote:
4. Build at home as long as you possibly can! Once you move to a hangar, even if it is close by, it changes EVERYTHING!

I've found this point to be exceedingly true. I really miss building in my basement. I didn't realize how much time I was saving by just going down and working/looking/thinking with the plane at home. Now that it's at the hangar nearing completion, my overall time spent is far less productive.

I know exactly how this is. If I have to go to the bathroom while working on the flight line, I have to pack up everything, lock it up, and clean up just so I can go to the bathroom for 5 minutes. At least when i have to transition to a hangar, I can somewhat leave things how I had them and just come back to resume work. I won't have all of the regulations and rules to follow in my own shop! But yea, walking into the garage is a lot quicker than driving to a hangar.

Thanks for the warm welcome and all the advice! I am really excited about this, and I look forward to keeping you guys posted when I start my build.

Thank you for the advice. I was not thinking about the center stick to sit in the middle. I plan to fly from the left seat all the time. I wanted it more to have a side stick than a center stick. I was going to install an armrest in the middle so when i am flying cross country I can just kind of cruise!

What I was trying to say is that it's difficult at best, to fly from the left and have a stick at your right side. With a passenger it's VERY difficult to get the stick to go full left/right, and uncomfortable for both you and your passenger. And there is no room for an armrest in a Sonex. Way too tight. Again, before you decide you should try very hard to see if you can sit in a Sonex, especially one with a center stick.

2. I am thinking the same thing with the scratch building. I will mainly be doing it to be doing something as funds are available. When I was younger I did a lot of wood working with my grandpa, and before this deployment I started buying some tools so I could build a storage bed for my wife. I plan on buying the tools that I need to fab parts that I will have use for again like a band saw and probably a lot of other things.

I found using a metal cutting blade instead of the Sonex-recommended wood cutting blade, made things cut better and smoother, and created less noise in the shop.

4. I do plan to build almost entirely at home. I live on base, and I can probably get permission to take off and fly it to the airport I will keep it at when it is finished. But that will also depend on how much equipment I need to mount the wings and finish completion. I plan to build it 100% - wings attached in my garage. I am going to explore the possibility of a quick disconnect system for any electronics and flight controls in the wings

The Sonex wings are removeable for transport, so the controls are already fairly easily disconnected. I made quick-disconnect fittings for the wires going to my wing lights, so that's very doable.

I think the advice for center vs side - to sit in both configurations - is good advice. You have some time before you have to decide. Though the F15 is super cool, and the FBW side stick is also cool, it is tough to beat the center stick/ left hand throttle setup as well. Our previous Air Superiority fighter, the P51, had this configuration. So does every pitts, extra, super cub, and glider. I do not think you can fit an armrest in unless you are a mini-person less than 5' tall.

I am doing Sport Trainer controls for the sake of my kids. I will probably fly solo from the right seat. I will fly on both sides so I am comfortable on either.