Onex vs Sonex/Waiex-B

[dxlusby84]

As I approach the trigger pull on a sonex model, I'm trying to figure out what I may not be considering between models. From a cost perspective, the B-models don't appear to be substantially more expensive than a onex kit, given the upgrades they bundle into the prices (only $3000 difference once you figure in the pre-assembled main spar and machined angle components). I'm a big guy (6'0", 330 lbs right now, shooting for 250 flight weight in a few years), and have sat in both a sonex A-model and Onex. The onex was roomy enough to feel comfortable in, while the sonex felt like the second seat would not be practical for a passenger given how much my own bulk would consume.

1. Do folks fly cross-country in their Onex's? Seattle to Oshkosh is a trip I'd like to make.
2. Does the Onex have a 'utility' gross weight, similar to how the sonex/waiex have both a utility/aerobatics gross?
3. I've heard mixed statements regarding center stick for Waiex and have several questions:

* * Can center stick be done on Waiex-B?
* * Heavy guy like me going to have a problem with seat pan / control rod interference? Seen some stuff saying the seat bows down and rubs against the rods
* * In general, how do folks feel about center vs dual stick. I've only ever flown dual stick or yolk.

4. Is there a significant difference in build hours or build complexity between Onex and Sonex/Waiex? (Assume main spar / angle component upgrades)
5. I think I've read that the AeroVee Turbo is hard to fit beneath a onex Cowl - true?
6. Would anyone ever consider building AeroVee naturally aspirated, get the plane flying, then do the turbo upgrade afterwards? I need to set achievable goals and one way to do that is by building 'simpler' stuff early and upgrading later.

Any and all responses welcome - planning on committing to a tail kit before the holiday specials are over, and that necessitates a model commitment!

Thanks!

[jowens]

Welcome,
Great post! I'm building a second-hand sonex A-model.
-I may be reading the sonex website incorrectly- I see the Onex complete kit at $16,700 and waiex at $23,000
-There is a spectrum of sizes of happy Sonex pilots, the Onex adjustable rudder pedals may fit your height better.
3. I believe the B model only offers the center Y stick. Seat pan bowing definitely occurs on the A model. The B model has a number of ribs under the seat pan to address bowing.

Sorry, can't help with your other questions.

One thing to consider on the Onex is the ability trailer it to and from the airport- possibility eliminating monthly hangar rent cost and allow you to perform upgrades at home. It is often said that building an airplane offsite will increase the calendar months of the build. Building is fun but is challenging, anything that may become a barrier to progress could impact your fun. Most experimental airplanes are never "done" transporting it home could be a big deal.

Another consideration is the instrumentation you want in your airplane. There isn't a lot of panel space on the onex versus the B model.

Third- flight training and flight reviews in the Onex is not an option. As you have said, a passenger may not be practical but it is a matter of impossible (Onex) and unlikely (Sonex).

Jim
Rochester, MN

[fastj22]

my two cents and worth every dime.

The biggest benefits of the Onex would be the folding wings for storage, and the lower kit costs.
The biggest benefits of the B-Waiex would be a bigger cockpit and increased useful load/fuel.
Complexity will be similar, Sonex says the turbo will fit the Onex, haven't seen it yet.
All B models are now center stick so you can fly it center with your feet on the outer pedals. Someone your size probably won't ever have a passenger besides a child or small woman < 100lbs. The bigger cockpit will allow you to stuff stuff around you for a long XC. It fills up fast.

If the folding wings isn't a big deal for you and the added cost of the B model doesn't scare you away, I'd go with the B. Waiex of course, but I'm spoiled.

[Bryan Cotton]

I would definitely build a center stick Waiex and sit in the middle if my main mission was flying solo. I sat in one and it is bigger than a Pawnee cockpit as a single place! The Onex is cool in its own right and the folding wings are handy for storage reasons. I am building naturally aspirated now and plan to upgrade after I fly it for 5 years or so.

[wlarson861]

As to the Onex cross country, I met a Onex builder a couple of years ago at Oshkosh. He had flown in from the Boston area that year. So yes long cross country is doable. I built my Sonex as a normally aspirated Aerovee and flew 3 1/2 years that way. I then upgraded to the turbo. By buying the turbo package up front you will save a little money over an upgrade later. You also will have the turbo engine in place when you install all the accessories on the fire wall. When I upgraded I spent more than half the time moving things like battery, electrical contactor etc. Plus I have a propeller intake manifold and exhaust sitting in the hangar. With props at over $1000 a copy, this adds to the cost of a later upgrade. Also my wife and I combined weigh about 275 pounds, add a little baggage on a hot, day take off and climb could get exciting. I would recommend going turbo from the beginning no matter which air frame you choose. As far as simpler, the turbo is no more complex than the normally aspirated engine to build or install. NA you still have to install an exhaust and intake and an aero injector. with the turbo you add the turbo and oil filter and lines. Barely 2 or 3 hours extra work. Just my opinion, your mileage may vary.

[dxlusby84]

Thanks to everybody for the feedback!

To the first responder, the cost difference I see between the Onex and Sonex/Waiex is significant if you don't choose the $4500 upgrades for the pre assembled main spar and machined angle components, which come stock on the b model kits. Take the upgrade and the difference between the kits drops to only $3k. I'd welcome any more comments, I'll need to zero in on something in a few weeks :)

[Onex107]

My opinion. I owned a Cessna 150 for 21 years. During the first few years I flew kids and friends frequently. For the last 10 years I was mostly solo. I fly now for my own enjoyment in my Onex. The folding wing was a big seller also. I have been hangared, in a standard T hangar with a Cessna 150 for two years by folding one wing. High wing, low wing, good combination.
1. I wouldn't count on trailering the Onex any distance. Even with the folded wings locked in place with the brackets, they are fragile forward and aft. I think it would be hard on the plane to do that very often. Remember, those wings want to fly at 50 mph.
2. Build time was 14 months, in my half of a two car garage. I competed the fuselage, including the main spars, engine, and electronics, moved it to the airport, then built the short wings. The stub wings are only eight feet wide. Very convenient to be able to work a few hours every day. My wife's car never moved. The build was pure pleasure.
3. Finally, the standard Aerovee is a good fit for the Onex. The performance is very good. There is a reason for the evolution of the Turbo addition to the Sonex two place. To get the same performance in the two place Sonex you need the extra hp. the Turbo provides.
4. Onex 107 has flown 140 hours and counting. It flies like a Cessna 150, only aerobatic, and 25 mph faster.

[bnvoss]

I just have one comment. I have been flying a tri-gear Sonex for 10 years with 485 hours. It is center stick and I only fly in the center. Extremely comfortable with my 6 ft-2 in and 250 lb frame. I didn't want and have never flown with a passenger. It's a great big-bubba airplane. Lots of headroom and legroom. Good luck with that weight loss thing.

Bob Sonex 550, Jabiru 2200

[sonex1374]

The Onex and Sonex are made for different missions: The Onex is a sporty plane for taking out and having fun. It's fast with an 80 hp AeroVee, convenient to store with its small size and folding wings, and all about the pilot experience. You can travel in this plane, as with any plane, but that's not its intended mission. The Sonex gives up some of these qualities by being a bit bigger, a bit slower on the same power, and a bit more expensive, but in exchange you get a more versatile plane. More room, more baggage and one more seat to share the experience. These features allow a few more options.

Figure out your mission and the choice should become clear. From what you asked, it appears that cross country travel is something you want to do. The extra storage room in a Sonex will make this an easier experience. However, many people way overestimate the number and frequency of trips they'll take, and end up underutilizing the capability they bought.

So if I oversimplify this decision, it looks like this: the Onex is all about the pure pilot experience, while the Sonex is more about versatility.

Jeff

[vwglenn]

I think the major cost benefit of the Onex is on the back end. The folding wing option would allow you to significantly reduce the cost to store it in a safe place.

The cross country aspect wouldn't be much different between one airframe and the other. The only difference would be the amount of stuff you could take with.

I think most of the other comments have addressed your issues.