New guy with build questions

[OtterlyFoolish]

I am just getting started in GA at 53. Been interested forever but life gets in the way. I logged a couple hours 20 years ago and am now following through to get my PPL. While I am working on that I just bought a Waiex B quick build kit that has some work completed but not a lot. I am going to scour this site for details but I have a couple general question to start with. I am sure that most of the answers depend on the mission but seeing how I am completely new I have to start somewhere or at least gather opinions that I can sort through as I go.

I am comfortable with the construction aspect and the kit I am getting has the engine kit and prop already. I am a little stumped on the panel. I know that I should wait to buy that stuff close to final assembly but I need to at least start planning now. What are the must have's? I definitely want to monitor the engine closely seeing how my arse is on the line up there so I was considering one of the MGL efis but the screen looks a little cluttered with everything on the display at once. Two displays seems like overkill for these little planes.

Is it less work and or money to set up a basic 6 pack and then an engine monitor set up? Is a basic 6 pack even an option considering the weight? I guess I need to see what all the options are so that I can make a more informed decision and a lot of you guys have done this multiple times. I am not sure where to even start looking. At this point I am thinking that I will fly this for a few years to build some time and probably start building or buy a 4 place plane later.

I am open to suggestions. Like I said before, I have plenty of time before I need to order this stuff at this point.

Thanks,
Marc

[Sonex1517]

Hi Marc!

Welcome to the community!

Where are you located?

These days an EFIS with EMS built in is the best idea. Many choices, and as you said wait as long as possible to decide.

Dynon, GRT, and several other manufacturers are all good options. Each has give and take.

Glad to see you asking this stuff before tackling the build!

[BRS]

Hi Marc,

As you will learn in your flight training FAR 91.205 specifies what instruments are required...
http://www.faa-aircraft-certification.com/91-205-civil-aircraft-standard-category.html

I'm just finishing up the rebuild of a Sonex-A where I gutted the panel and installed a MGL MX1 EFIS. Here are some Pros & Cons...
Pros:
-RDAC break out box sits on the firewall where all the engine wires go to. Thus there are only 4 (I used a single cable) or so wires that go to the panel.
-Customizable screen layout's. This allows you to design the screens as you wish. See also Cons below.
-Many many options and flexibility & moving map
-Price
Cons:
-Configuration can be a bear, especially if you are not computer friendly.
-Customer service is not so great and most answers are best found by digging through the forum.
-Not made in USA

If you decide to go with a six-pac I do like the MGL BLAZE series.

[OtterlyFoolish]

Thanks guys, I was definitely thinking efis but I was also thinking about an ASI, Altimeter and magnetic compass just in case there was an electrical issue. At that point I was not sure if the efis was really a bonus or just to go with the 6 pack and then maybe an EMS. I wouldn't worry if I was a decades long experienced pilot but seeing how I am just starting I certainly do not want to leave myself in an avoidable situation.

[lakespookie]

I am going Garmin and IFR capable although i dont plan on any hard IFR flight in the sonex due to engine choice and its stability, That being said Dynon and Garmin both have Backup instruments that basically have everything you need in an emergency if you lose the efis to put it on the ground safely + the sonex really is a VFR platform, as examples i am installing a G5, and dynon has a similar product in the D10 if you go with one of the other options a Blaze single can serve as a backup instrument with similar capabilities.

[Rynoth]

Thanks guys, I was definitely thinking efis but I was also thinking about an ASI, Altimeter and magnetic compass just in case there was an electrical issue. At that point I was not sure if the efis was really a bonus or just to go with the 6 pack and then maybe an EMS. I wouldn't worry if I was a decades long experienced pilot but seeing how I am just starting I certainly do not want to leave myself in an avoidable situation.

I agree that a screen for engine monitoring is pretty much a no-brainier these days, as the ease of adding probes etc to an RDAC is a lot easier than wiring so many individual gauges. I also like airspeed/alt on my display (as mentioned above for the newer MGL products at least, the screen is customizable.) As for backups, I have airspeed covered using a Lift Reserve Indicator, (non-electrical) which is all I need for stall protection and best glide/landing speeds, and gives me additional info an airspeed indicator can't. Backup mag compass is an auto-store suction cup compass. Altitude backup is covered by my ipad and Foreflight app, which has all of your GPS data (groundspeed, gps altimiter, and all charts/navigation/weather.) So in an electrical failure I still have the ipad battery for navigation/altitude, LRI for low-speed, compass.

Worth mentioning that a display that also uses a gps source for navigation is nice as a backup if using ipad/foreflight, so if the ipad dies can still use the display to direct-to an airport.

[OtterlyFoolish]

Dynon and Garmin both have Backup instruments that basically have everything you need in an emergency if you lose the efis to put it on the ground safely

Are you saying that the efis systems have backup batteries in them that will continue to function for a period of time after power failure? I was not aware of that. That would be helpful.

[OtterlyFoolish]

So in an electrical failure I still have the ipad battery for navigation/altitude, LRI for low-speed, compass.

Interesting, I will look into the LRI. I was planning on using Foreflight so that could work for me.

I am a long way from being ready still but I love the idea of the customizable MGL panel. Can a single pitot tube run both the MGL along with an extra ASI and altimeter?

[fastj22]

My two cents and worth every penny....

EMS is nice. let the computer monitor the engine and let you know when things go pear shaped. I have the MGL xTreme EMS and it works fine. Just like the others.

Primary flight instruments, go with basics whether its steam or electronic. Nothing like looking at dials. You don't need fancy moving maps overlaid on approach plates with all the fancy bugs you couldn't identify if someone held a gun to your head. I used the MGL xTreme EFIS, there are better out there but it works. I have autopilot, its nice, but definitely not necessary. At the time, I was making good money and just looked for reasons to spend money at Airventure. If you want all that movie stuff, the iPad running Foreflight, flyQ or Wingx(are they still around?) will provide plenty of inflight entertainment.

One thing to really consider is a LRI (Lift Reserve Indicator or AOA). A few years back someone was selling these on the innertubes which is basically a HVAC filter gauge (differential pressure to tell you when to replace the filter) and custom inkjet printed card, plumbed to a 3D printed probe, mounted under the wing that measured the differential pressure from two sources. You calibrate by flying into a stall, land, adjust the probe, fly again into a stall, adjust the probe, repeat until it stalls right at the red line on the gauge. After that, if you keep it above the red, you won't be dead. No electrons (pixies), just air. Works at all airspeeds and density altitudes. Life saver. These fancy EFISs do the same thing, but require angry pixies to make it work. If you can find the guy who was making these its worth the $250 and when all the pixies fly away from you, you still have something to land with. And you will land much slower than you ever thought you could.

[mike.smith]

Modern EFIS with EMS are just fantastic. So much USEFUL information at your fingertips, in a very small form factor. Just some, that you don't get with steam gauges:
- Winds aloft
- Ground Speed, True Airspeed (not just indicated airspeed)
- G-meter
- Flight timer
- Density altitude
- If you want to, you may be able to have your comm radio and/or transponder located remotely, and controlled through the EFIS

You can choose to display linear tapes, round gauges, or even both. You can format the layout to match your own tastes, and you can change over time as your needs or preferences change (they do), or as you add or change hardware. As noted, many systems have optional backup batteries to run the instruments if you lose power.

EMS information is in a very small form factor, for ALL cylinders (EGT & CHT), fuel flow, fuel remaining, voltage, oil pressure, oil temp, RPM. Engine and flight data can be recorded and downloaded for analysis.

The Sonex panel is limited, so electronic instruments go a long way to allowing you to put everything you want into your panel. I recommend you physically try the ones you are thinking of (like at Airventure), not just pick it based on the literature.