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Fastcapy wrote:You know 2 gallons and 80 gallons are pretty close so I can see how they could make that mistake...SMH

Not to mention the fact that the airplane doesn't even hold 80 gallons! Gotta love the news reporters!

2 gallons is not as sensational as 80.

Gripdana wrote:2 gallons is not as sensational as 80.

The plane is so small, I bet the fuel spill looked bigger.

Hello SonexBuilders.net,

First, to the moderators: in all fairness, can you please change the title of this thread from "accident" to "incident" per FAA definition?

We heard from Redge yesterday and he is just fine. Very minor damage, and the cause of the gear-up was the same as John's. The square-bottom of the SubSonex fuselage makes a gear-up very uneventful, which is great! We were able to replace a couple belly skins and repair the inboard flaps on "Sharky" in only a day’s work.

Regarding the fuel spill, the SubSonex has a fuel drain valve on the belly, but it is not at the low-point of the fuselage that would have directly contacted the runway and it is not proud of the belly skin surface. I have no direct information from Redge on this aspect, but either a piece of debris, like an antenna, depressed the valve, or (perhaps more likely) the airport workers depressed the valve when lifting the aircraft.

Since the Oshkosh gear-up, John has been busy devising a very simple gear warning system -- you know what they say about the mother of invention… The LED warning light system uses an interlock between the flap handle and gear indicator. If flaps are extended with the gear-up, bright multi-color LED’s at the top of the instrument panel will flash until you extend the gear. We’ll have all of the electronic components and installation instructions for that system included in an update package to be sent to SubSonex customers next week. MGL Avionics is also working on a firmware update for the iEFIS Explorer instrument to allow a gear warning indication to show-up on the iEFIS display using a single-wire input from the gear warning system electronics package we are providing. Pre-programmed SubSonex checklists will also be available for the iEFIS Explorer avionics package soon.





Have a great weekend everyone, and fly safe!

Regards,
-Mark
--
Mark Schaible
General Manager
Sonex Aircraft, LLC
phone: 920-231-8297
fax: 920-426-8333
http://www.SonexAircraft.com
http://www.AeroConversions.com

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As someone who's actually gone through the FAA's Basic Accident Investigation course, I can say whether it's classified as an accident or incident can certainly be subject to interpretation and circumstances.

An incident: “an occurrence involving one or more aircraft in which a hazard or a potential hazard to safety is involved but not classified as an accident due to the degree of injury and/or extent of damage.”

They used an example in the course of a couple similar aircraft which both had a nose gear collapse. One was classified and an "accident" and the other an "incident" even though the events appeared identical on the surface. The difference was in the nature of the failure. One broke in such a way that it damaged part of the fuselage internally where it mounted and required extensive repair. The other just fell on the nose and did minor skin damage.

Another determining factor is "serious injury". Any "incident" becomes an "accident" when there is a "serious injury." In our gear collapse scenario, if the nose gear on the "incident" aircraft collapses and a passenger or crew member has a spinal injury as a result, the "incident" becomes an "accident" regardless of the damage to an aircraft. But what determines a "serious injury"? Broken finger? Concussion? This is where things can get a little confusing and, since every injury is different, subject to interpretation.

Another thing... It's been my experience that the news is ALWAYS wrong or partially wrong on every single story to which I've been witness. So be extremely careful when you point at news stories. You're probably perpetuating incorrect or misleading information.

I agree that John's adventure barely qualifies as an incident. If it happened at some remote uncontrolled airstrip it likely wouldn't be known by anyone other than the operator and the crew that put it back on the wheels.